Episode 7
The Evolution of Dating: From Courtship to Casual Encounters
The prevailing inquiry addressed in this discourse revolves around the question of whether individuals are engaging in romantic pursuits with the explicit intention of matrimony. I assert, with conviction, that contemporary statistics demonstrate a marked decline in marriage rates, accompanied by a notable absence of cohabitation among younger demographics. This episode endeavors to explore the paradigms of dating, juxtaposing historical perspectives with present-day practices, thereby revealing a significant evolution in societal norms surrounding intimate relationships. We delve into the myriad terminologies that have emerged in the modern dating lexicon, elucidating their implications and the behaviors they describe. As we navigate through the complexities of dating today, we invite listeners to reflect upon their own experiences and the shifting dynamics of romantic interactions in an increasingly digital age. Dating in contemporary society presents a stark contrast to its historical antecedents, as articulated by the speakers in this engaging discourse. They delve into the notion of whether individuals are dating with the intent to marry, concluding that, contrary to traditional expectations, many are not. Statistical evidence is marshaled to support the assertion that cohabitation rates are declining and that even among younger generations, there exists a notable absence of physical intimacy, a phenomenon intriguingly tied to the emergence of new social dynamics and cultural shifts. The speakers reflect on their personal experiences of dating in previous decades, characterized by distinct social norms and expectations. They reminisce about the more rigid codes of conduct that governed early romantic interactions, including awkward first kisses and the limitations placed on physical affection. This nostalgia contrasts sharply with the current landscape where, they suggest, the rules have become more ambiguous, leading to potentially superficial connections devoid of genuine intent. The discussion progresses to address the modern dating scene’s complexities, including the prevalence of casual encounters and the implications of dating apps, which have fundamentally altered interpersonal dynamics. A critical theme emerges regarding the psychological mechanisms underlying contemporary dating behavior. The speakers explore the phenomenon of emotional detachment in modern relationships, highlighting the prevalence of gaslighting and love bombing as tactics employed by individuals seeking validation rather than authentic connection. Through this lens, they present a compelling argument that many individuals engage in dating not for commitment but for ego reinforcement. The episode culminates in a call for a deeper understanding of the motivations behind dating behaviors, urging listeners to reflect on their own experiences and the emotional ramifications of the dating culture that pervades today’s society. The discourse navigates the intricate terrain of modern dating, with the speakers expressing a keen interest in dissecting the current state of romantic relationships. They inquire about the intentions underlying contemporary dating practices, positing that many individuals are no longer pursuing relationships with marriage as a goal. This assertion is substantiated by a review of statistical trends indicating decreasing marriage rates and a shift towards non-traditional relationship structures, wherein physical intimacy is sometimes altogether absent. The speakers juxtapose their own past experiences with the present dating landscape, reminiscing about the structured and often conservative nature of courtship in previous generations. They reflect on the societal norms that once dictated romantic interactions, such as the necessity of parental approval and the gradual progression of physical intimacy. This nostalgic exploration serves as a backdrop against which they critique the current dating paradigm, which they argue has become increasingly ambiguous and, at times, disingenuous. A significant portion of the conversation is dedicated to examining the psychological underpinnings of dating behaviors today, particularly the prevalence of gaslighting and emotional manipulation. The speakers assert that many individuals engage in dating as a means of fulfilling psychological needs rather than forming genuine connections. They advocate for a more profound comprehension of these dynamics, encouraging listeners to consider the emotional toll of navigating a dating culture rife with superficiality and insincerity. The episode concludes with a call to action, urging individuals to cultivate awareness of their dating experiences and the underlying motivations that drive their interactions.
Takeaways:
- The current dating landscape indicates that individuals are not pursuing marriage as an outcome.
- Statistical evidence suggests a notable decline in marriage and cohabitation among younger generations.
- Contemporary relationships often lack physical intimacy, reflecting changing societal norms and values.
- Modern dating is characterized by increased ambiguity, with diverse interpretations of what it means to 'date' today.
- There is a significant prevalence of dishonesty in today's dating culture, where individuals may engage in gaslighting and love bombing.
- The evolution of women's roles in society has led to greater financial independence, influencing their relationship dynamics.
Transcript
Are people dating with intent to get married?
Speaker A:I don't think so.
Speaker A:The numbers are.
Speaker A:The statistics are that people aren't getting married.
Speaker A:They aren't cohabitating.
Speaker A:There's even people, younger people, who don't even ever actually have a physical intimacy.
Speaker A:And maybe you'd badly kiss each other.
Speaker A:You didn't know how to really kiss, and you'd learn how to tongue kiss.
Speaker A:And all seemed very gross.
Speaker A:Maybe, you know, you get to first base or second, this was very racy.
Speaker A:And they'd want to maybe touch your booby, but you would let them only go over the bra, but not under the bra.
Speaker A:When I would see him in the server, I'd be there, and I'd be on the bikini in my beach, and I'd see him.
Speaker A:We went, mm, look at each other.
Speaker B:What I'm saying is people didn't have a lot of options back then.
Speaker B:As in, women weren't as loose.
Speaker B:I feel like women are a lot more looser now because.
Speaker A:What do you mean by loose?
Speaker A:Are you talking about promiscuous?
Speaker B:Three men a week, different ones.
Speaker B:You know, they just enjoy sex.
Speaker A:It's an ambiguous term.
Speaker A:You could be sleeping together, you might not be sleeping together.
Speaker A:It's an ambiguous term.
Speaker B:It's meant to be ambiguous excuse for cheating.
Speaker B:I feel today the dishonesty is a lot more where people are gaslighting.
Speaker B:People love bombing them.
Speaker A:Here's the thing.
Speaker A:Cheaters don't want to be cheated on.
Speaker A:The validation doesn't come from being honest.
Speaker A:Cheaters have a need, a psychological need to cheat.
Speaker A:Hello.
Speaker A:Thank you for joining Amanda and myself, Madeline.
Speaker A:And we're going to talk today about dating.
Speaker A:We're trying to get into how to date.
Speaker A:What's the history, sort of what dating used to look like.
Speaker A:I think I'm the dinosaur more than Amanda, but.
Speaker A:And then what it looks like currently and some of the terminology, just to kind of get through it.
Speaker A:And we're going to start right there.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I look forward to this episode as well.
Speaker B:But girls and guys, please keep it off the record, because we're going to be delving in into all that terminology.
Speaker A:And I think that maybe between the two of us, Amanda and Madeline, we are dating experts, would you say?
Speaker B:I don't know if we're dating experts, but we will find out at the end of the show, wouldn't we?
Speaker A:There's going to be a quiz.
Speaker A:She's going to quiz me.
Speaker B:Yeah, I'm going to quiz you.
Speaker B:Because there's so many new terms that come that are kind Of I think Gen Z that we don't know.
Speaker A:Well, let me start with a question then.
Speaker A:We're going to talk about dating and obviously dating from a generation ago to now is a huge difference.
Speaker A:And you know, are people dating with intent to get married?
Speaker A:I don't think so.
Speaker A:The numbers are, the statistics are that people aren't getting married, they aren't cohabitating enough and that there's even people, younger people who don't even ever actually have physical intimacy.
Speaker A:I mean there's whole kind of weird incels and things that I've never heard of.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:But let's talk about dating now for, for women our age.
Speaker B:Maybe before we talk about dating now, let's start with dating in the past.
Speaker B:What was dating in the past like?
Speaker B:Because some people now don't know what dating in the past was like.
Speaker A:Okay, so I, I'll tell you.
Speaker A:Dating in the past, you would you, when you were young and you were in high school and this is really a day, the day before mobile phones.
Speaker A:When I was dating, you know, in the very beginning in junior high school, it was like, okay, you're my girlfriend, you're my boyfriend.
Speaker A:And then you were boyfriend and girlfriend and maybe you'd badly kiss each other, you didn't know how to really kiss and you'd learn how to tongue kiss and all seemed very gross.
Speaker A:And then they'd maybe, you know, you get to first base or second, this was very racy and they'd want to maybe touch your booby, but you would let them only go over the bra, but not under the bra.
Speaker A:I mean there were all these rules to how levels of how quickly you could proceed.
Speaker A:And it wasn't that quick.
Speaker A:You remember, there was no porn, there was no anything else.
Speaker A:Like, and by the way, I don't know about you, but when I was in junior high, starting junior high, I had a super thick padded bra.
Speaker A:So someone even got to go over the bra.
Speaker A:They were feeling anything but foam.
Speaker B:It was a lot of, you know.
Speaker B:But when I say that, I mean dating in the past more like, you know, I mean, I think I didn't exist because in the old, old days you couldn't even date until they met your father.
Speaker B:Because I, when I watched those movies in the old days, they had to come to your house and ask your father to take you even on a date.
Speaker B:That's what I, I mean that's not what I experienced.
Speaker B:But that was in the, you know, before us.
Speaker A:Well, and then yes, I did have a little bit about that.
Speaker A:Not quite Not Okay.
Speaker A:So I'm obviously like, what, 10 years older, maybe more older than you.
Speaker A:We didn't.
Speaker A:When I was in high school, when you started dating, you didn't have to ask your father's permission, but he had to come to the door, pick me up, sit, say hello.
Speaker A:My father.
Speaker A:Yes, my father, who.
Speaker A:Who is a nuclear submarine commander.
Speaker A:Okay, a nuclear submarine commander.
Speaker A:Let me say that again.
Speaker A:So it's not always so easy.
Speaker A:And he'd sit there, and I remember having this date.
Speaker A:And, you know, I grew up largely in Hawaii, and this, in my opinion, totally hot surfer guy, you know, that I was like, oh, like, when I would see him in the surf, I'd be there, and I'd be on the bikini of my beach, and I'd see him.
Speaker A:We went, mm, look at each other.
Speaker A:He's like, okay, you want to go see a movie?
Speaker A:We'd go out and we'd say, okay.
Speaker A:So he'd come, and my father, he'd sat down.
Speaker A:I remember my father says, and, you know, what are you studying now?
Speaker A:Are you.
Speaker A:And he said, I just like surfing.
Speaker A:And he says, and what are you going to do after?
Speaker A:Are you going to university?
Speaker A:What are your plans for the future?
Speaker A:He says, surf.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:And I could just see.
Speaker A:And then the thing was that I had a curfew.
Speaker A:I had to be home at a certain time, and if I missed that curfew, then I could not go out the following weekend.
Speaker A:I was.
Speaker A:I was.
Speaker A:I was grounded for.
Speaker A:Okay, that.
Speaker A:That.
Speaker A:I had to respect that.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So that's dating, you know, as a teen or an early adult.
Speaker B:But, you know, when we talk about dating after that, because even dating after that, I think in the past, men were more responsible.
Speaker B:So pick you up.
Speaker B:Yes, I was going to say that a man would pick you up, he'll take you on a date.
Speaker B:There wasn't a lot of gaslighting.
Speaker B:I think people kind of communicated better.
Speaker A:The nice ones still do.
Speaker A:I mean, if you.
Speaker A:If in the beginning.
Speaker A:Look, I have this sort of rule.
Speaker A:If I'm going on a date and I don't know them, I do not give them my address to pick me up because I may not want to see them again.
Speaker A:And I would suggest anyone else, if you're just maybe going back into the dating pool, no need to give them your address, meet them until you want to, you know, in case.
Speaker A:And then after that, though, they most certainly should pick you up.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:So in the past, the guy would come.
Speaker B:They'll come to your house, and he'll pick you up, maybe after the first date, you gave him your address.
Speaker B:So he picks you up and you'll go on this date.
Speaker B:And not every date worked out.
Speaker B:But also, I think in the past people didn't date as much because they were more.
Speaker B:What would I say?
Speaker B:You would.
Speaker B:You would choose a partner or you would.
Speaker B:You would date someone you really liked.
Speaker B:And I think there wasn't that many options.
Speaker A:Let's talk about paying the bill.
Speaker A:Let's say you have the date, but.
Speaker B:We haven't got to that stage yet.
Speaker B:We haven't gone through.
Speaker B:No, we've got to the date.
Speaker B:But you know, what I'm saying is people didn't have a lot of options back then.
Speaker B:As in, women weren't as loose.
Speaker B:I feel like women are a lot more looser now because.
Speaker A:What do you mean by loose?
Speaker A:Are you talking about promiscuous?
Speaker B:Not promiscuous.
Speaker B:Just like people are more free with their sexuality, so we're more.
Speaker B:Yeah, I think in the past women were not as free with their sexuality.
Speaker B:Women have got to know themselves much better now than we did before.
Speaker B:And we like.
Speaker B:I know girls today that could date three men a week.
Speaker B:Different ones.
Speaker B:They.
Speaker B:People, you know, they just enjoy sex.
Speaker B:Where in the past.
Speaker A:I keep confusing when you're saying dating and sex, because the two are different.
Speaker A:To me in New York, in today's.
Speaker B:World, they're almost the same because they're people that date for sex.
Speaker B:Now.
Speaker A:I see.
Speaker A:But dating, everyone asks me, when I first moved to London from New York, people would question.
Speaker A:I would get quite often, what does dating mean?
Speaker A:I said, it means you're seeing each other.
Speaker A:It's an ambiguous term.
Speaker A:You could be sleeping together, you might not be sleeping together.
Speaker A:It's an ambiguous term.
Speaker A:It's meant to be ambiguous.
Speaker A:You're seeing each other.
Speaker A:You may not.
Speaker B:That's an important comment you make.
Speaker B:Because for a long time I didn't know what dating was.
Speaker B:Coming from the uk, and I used to say when I went to America, when I was modeling and I lived in New York, I used to say to people where I come from, you just get in a relationship.
Speaker B:And that's how it was.
Speaker B:Here you meet a guy, you get on, and after three months, he's your boyfriend.
Speaker A:After three months?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because you know, you know, you meet a guy, if he keeps on seeing you or you keep on seeing him, you're in a relationship.
Speaker A:In the US we used to.
Speaker A:You had to have the talk.
Speaker B:Yeah, that was what I couldn't understand.
Speaker B:I was like, what talk?
Speaker B:Are you talking about.
Speaker B:What on earth are you talking about?
Speaker A:Well, you both agree to be.
Speaker A:Be just with each other, but here.
Speaker B:In Europe, it was an unsaid rule.
Speaker B:The fact that you kept on seeing each other means you're in a relationship where in the US Each person was seeing multiple people.
Speaker B:So they had to have a talk to decide that I'm only going to be with you.
Speaker B:Yes, that was what the talk was really about.
Speaker A:And by the way, the talk could go either way.
Speaker A:So I lived in New York in the late 90s, and I was dating and working, and it was.
Speaker A:You could date.
Speaker A:Dating did not mean sleeping with someone.
Speaker A:Then you could date.
Speaker A:You could go on a date with someone, you could go date several dates, but it did not mean sleeping.
Speaker A:It could mean.
Speaker A:But it doesn't necessarily mean.
Speaker A:And you were not exclusive unless you had the talk.
Speaker A:And that was just very clear.
Speaker A:Like, you remember the sex and the.
Speaker A:They went on a little further.
Speaker A:They were.
Speaker A:Your third date, you had sex.
Speaker A:That was not part of When I was dating.
Speaker A:It was, okay, first you could.
Speaker A:And I remember, and I remember at this point, I was working really hard.
Speaker A:I was working at a bank, and I was down on Wall Street.
Speaker A:I was just working all the time.
Speaker A:And it just didn't make much sense to me to be exclusive unless I felt really strongly that there was significant potential, like I wanted to marry someone.
Speaker A:And so I remember telling a guy, I said, I, um, Listen, I don't, I don't think that there's anything such thing as exclusivity unless there's a ring on my finger, which means you're free to do whatever you want.
Speaker A:You don't ask me, I don't ask you.
Speaker A:And unless this is really gonna be a serious relationship, you know, I've got other things happening.
Speaker A:And he was sort of astounded, I think.
Speaker A:But that was, that's.
Speaker A:I was very clear about that.
Speaker B:I agree.
Speaker B:But, you know, also, there's an emotional aspect.
Speaker B:So if you are dating more than one person, as women, Women tend to be more emotional.
Speaker A:So you're.
Speaker B:You' already attached to the one you like the most in a way, because.
Speaker A:Yeah, but you had to have your backup.
Speaker B:I agree, but I, I.
Speaker B:Not that I agree.
Speaker B:I'm not saying, like, you should date multiple people, which they do in America, by the way.
Speaker B:And in today's world, that's become normal.
Speaker B:And the, the concept of dating is worldwide now.
Speaker B:And I think the definition of dating is still confusing to a lot of people.
Speaker A:It's like what you said to Be an ambiguous term.
Speaker A:It's like a.
Speaker A:As an all encompass term.
Speaker A:It doesn't mean your boyfriend, if your boyfriend.
Speaker B:That's an excuse for cheating.
Speaker A:No, excuse me, there's married people who cheat.
Speaker A:I know an excuse not to cheat.
Speaker A:In other words, it's so you don't cheat.
Speaker B:What about, I say it's an excuse for commitment.
Speaker B:It's an excuse.
Speaker B:This dating thing.
Speaker B:I think I agree.
Speaker B:Date people.
Speaker B:But the thing is, I think a lot of people then use it as an excuse for not committing because if you're dating multiple people, they don't want to commit.
Speaker B:Yeah, but if everybody's doing it, then the world is pretty messed up.
Speaker A:That's where we are today.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:Because we are going to get to today.
Speaker B:Don't forget we're starting from 30 years behind and we're moving forward now.
Speaker B:Let's go to 20 years.
Speaker A:So then, so when we're talking about the dating in New York and the ambiguous term of dating, remember this is before dating apps and websites and all this sort of thing.
Speaker A:So, you know, you'd go on blind dates, you know, we didn't even have a picture.
Speaker A:Your friend would say, I'm gonna set you up with so and so.
Speaker A:And you know, a lot of people dreaded it.
Speaker A:I had a lot of friends.
Speaker A:I quite liked the blind date.
Speaker A:You know, as long as they chose a lovely restaurant and this and that was.
Speaker A:It was.
Speaker A:I didn't mind it.
Speaker A:And even if someone was not attractive, didn't matter.
Speaker A:You just had a lovely dinner and you left.
Speaker A:It wasn't any to me.
Speaker A:Big deal.
Speaker B:Okay, so would you say in the past there's a lot more respect in dating?
Speaker B:I think in the past there was more.
Speaker B:A lot.
Speaker B:There's a lot more respect in dating.
Speaker B:At least if someone wasn't interested, they would not call you, they would not be gaslighting you.
Speaker B:Where in today's world you've got all sorts of things.
Speaker B:Like a guy might not be really interested in a girl and he's dating other people, but he's still gaslighting the one.
Speaker B:He's not interested and he's not being honest to her.
Speaker B:Of course, there's always been dishonesty in relationships, whether dating or marriage or everything or anything like that.
Speaker B:There are always people that are dishonest.
Speaker B:But I feel today the dishonesty is a lot more where people are gaslighting people love bombing them.
Speaker B:Why are you smiling?
Speaker B:Are you?
Speaker A:I'm smiling because first of all, that's true, right?
Speaker A:People now with apps and things you know, we didn't have that many ways to connect.
Speaker A:We had to have, like a little social circle.
Speaker A:Someone had to set you up.
Speaker A:You had to go a bar or whatever you were doing.
Speaker A:However you're doing it today, there's lots of.
Speaker A:Because there's a lot of anonymity.
Speaker A:And you have these apps and you think you have a lot of selection and it's.
Speaker A:You're.
Speaker A:Some.
Speaker A:You're emotionally removed from the actual personal interaction.
Speaker A:And I was going to add that there are a lot of people dating for different reasons.
Speaker A:Married people dating.
Speaker A:If you do the statistics of people on the dating apps, you know, like.
Speaker A:Like 50%.
Speaker A:Some people, you're confusing dating for romance or wanting a connection to people who are dating because they want validation.
Speaker A:They want to hear how wonderful they are.
Speaker A:They're dating because they want to feel that there's all these women or men chasing them.
Speaker A:It's a whole different thing now.
Speaker B:The thing about it is you just said some things like people dating for validation.
Speaker B:People want to feel this.
Speaker B:I don't mind that as long as they are, you know, they let the other person know that's what they're doing.
Speaker B:The problem is they're not honest.
Speaker A:Of course they're not honest.
Speaker A:They don't even know it themselves.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:So that is the issue we have.
Speaker B:So that's the issue we're talking to our audience about.
Speaker B:So, you know, if you've had any of these, please let us know.
Speaker B:Make a comment down in and let us know.
Speaker B:Because I think that's the issue today.
Speaker B:You know, if we had apps where people just say, listen, I'm dating because I'm married and I just want to meet someone and talk to them and have some fun, then it's up to the other person to say, okay, I want to have some fun.
Speaker B:But what they do is they pretend like they're single.
Speaker B:They gaslight.
Speaker B:The other person.
Speaker B:The other person thinks, I found the one.
Speaker B:Because the other person, he or her may be looking for relationships.
Speaker B:He or she thinks, oh, I've met this person, you know, and I think they're going to be my future husband.
Speaker B:Meanwhile, that person is only out there trying to meet several people for dinners but not being honest.
Speaker A:Have you ever dated a cheater?
Speaker A:Like a serial cheater?
Speaker A:Not.
Speaker A:Not on purpose.
Speaker A:I mean, you didn't know and have.
Speaker B:Dated a serial cheater.
Speaker B:Because I can sniff them out.
Speaker B:You know me.
Speaker A:I did.
Speaker A:And the interesting thing, and I didn't realize it because I said to him, I said, look, I don't know what's going on here.
Speaker A:But I feel like you're not being honest.
Speaker A:And if you want to see other people, then fine, let's see other people be honest and I'll do it and you do it.
Speaker A:And he's like, you would do that?
Speaker A:You know, and here's the thing.
Speaker A:Cheaters don't want to be cheated on.
Speaker A:The validation doesn't come from being honest.
Speaker A:The validation comes from, you know, that a woman emotionally wanting to connect with you so you feel she is probably deeply psychological.
Speaker A:They want to feel that you want.
Speaker A:That you want the love.
Speaker A:It's nothing to do.
Speaker A:Something's whole from the mother, I don't know.
Speaker A:But cheaters have a need, a psychological need to cheat.
Speaker A:It's not that they want the honesty and say, you do this unless I'll be honest, they're avoiding that at all costs.
Speaker B:So let's talk about how we've come to this now, how dating, the world of dating has kind of broken down in this century.
Speaker B:I mean, I would say flourishing.
Speaker B:I don't know about flourishing, because what I find is there's a lot of loneliness, as you know.
Speaker A:That's true.
Speaker B:There's a lot of loneliness from both sides.
Speaker B:We.
Speaker B:We're both females and we have friends that are lonely.
Speaker B:We talk to people and they're men that are lonely and they're dating, but they don't feel fulfilled.
Speaker B:And especially the young men growing up find it harder to find relationships.
Speaker B:So how did we get here?
Speaker A:Well, anthropologically speaking, we're talking about women.
Speaker A:More women in the workplace than ever.
Speaker A:You got 50%.
Speaker A:They have options.
Speaker A:And statistically speaking, women do not need to be in a relationship to be financially supported anymore.
Speaker A:Well, yes, so.
Speaker A:So when that happened, when you had the ability to have at least close to financial equality, because that's a whole different subject.
Speaker A:But going in the workplace, which I really think the breakthrough was after, During World War II, I actually gave this a little thought.
Speaker A:I was thinking about it.
Speaker A:World War II, the men go off to war.
Speaker A:The women go work in the factories.
Speaker A:They've got to make money.
Speaker A:Then you got to have your bank account.
Speaker A:Then you're going to have this.
Speaker A:And then you're going to say, wait, what?
Speaker A:I want more for my daughter or maybe myself, and I want her to go to university or get education.
Speaker A:She has a good job.
Speaker A:So I think that was really the breakthrough, World War II.
Speaker A:So here we are.
Speaker A:This is just a progression towards equality.
Speaker A:They did these statistics.
Speaker A:I read this somewhere in China as soon as women.
Speaker A:So they Kind of went off the farm and they became industrialized.
Speaker A:And when women could work and make money, the suicide rates of women went down and the suicide rates of men went up.
Speaker A:Fact.
Speaker A:So I think that's what you have.
Speaker A:And another statistic, and there's every single study, every single study says this.
Speaker A:Women are happier when they're not married.
Speaker A:Men are happier when they are married.
Speaker B:I think I agree with you.
Speaker B:I think for women, it's more of a financial thing, because a woman that's single, that's not married women tend to have better relationships with each other, more emotional relationships.
Speaker B:So a lot of that emotional need is fulfilled by other women, female friendships and everything.
Speaker B:Men don't really.
Speaker B:I mean, very few men, you know, are that.
Speaker B:Are that emotionally connected with their male friends.
Speaker B:And also, I think for women, if you are financially secure and you have a good friendship group, if you don't have a guy, you're fine, you know, because also, women, I feel, don't have the sexual urge as the same sexual urge like men do.
Speaker B:Because a lot of men, that's why they get confused.
Speaker B:They get into these relationships because they want sex.
Speaker B:Let's be honest.
Speaker B:Like, some of them will get on those apps justified.
Speaker A:Well, you know, so, yeah.
Speaker A:How much success is he gonna say?
Speaker A:Just down to screw.
Speaker A:And I think everyone's gonna be rushing to call that guy or hook up.
Speaker A:Yeah, sure.
Speaker B:No, yeah.
Speaker B:So I think I do agree with you on that point.
Speaker B:Back to that point that women could be a lot more secure.
Speaker B:But everybody would like to find Mr. Wright or Mrs. Miss.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Sorry, not Mrs. You don't want to miss us.
Speaker B:You want to miss whatever.
Speaker A:I think that.
Speaker A:And I'll say this, whether they've wanted it or not or ended up this way, so I'm in my 50s.
Speaker A:I have friends in their 40s.
Speaker A:I've never seen so many such a high percentage of women, especially when they're in their late 40s, that aren't going to have children, haven't been married.
Speaker A:I would say the vast majority of them is a huge percentage.
Speaker A:As opposed to.
Speaker A:If you just go ten years up, then.
Speaker A:Then, you know, there's then many, many married couples.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So back to the question, Maddie, how did we get here?
Speaker A:I'll go back and say the same answer.
Speaker A:Equality and financial freedom and technology.
Speaker B:I think technology also added a lot because like you said earlier, dating apps, all these things where there's instant gratification.
Speaker B:You can just.
Speaker B:I mean, I remember once when I tried a dating app.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:I me tried a dating app.
Speaker A:I did too.
Speaker B:And you know, you just, you actually.
Speaker B:I had to stop myself because you get into this thing of just going.
Speaker B:It becomes like Instagram, okay?
Speaker B:And that's what a lot of men do that get on those dating apps, you know, because I meet girlfriends, I say, oh, he set up a date, then he canceled.
Speaker B:They're just like.
Speaker B:And some of them go on these apps just for instant gratification.
Speaker B:They're not even going to go on a date.
Speaker B:I mean, you have married men that will go on it just to feel good.
Speaker A:Because, you know, I think the married men are probably more likely to pitch up the single guys.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:I don't know that we're not saying.
Speaker B:Dating apps are bad because I also have friends that have met their partners on dating apps that have got married on dating apps that have wonderful relationships.
Speaker B:So dating apps are the new way forward because how you're going to meet someone and if you don't try to meet people, how you going to settle down?
Speaker B:But now we're going to talk about some of the modern terms like gaslighting, Ghosting.
Speaker B:Ghosting.
Speaker A:I like ghosting.
Speaker A:Have you ever ghosted anyone?
Speaker A:Be honest.
Speaker A:I've ghosted.
Speaker B:I've never ghosted.
Speaker B:Because I'll tell you, I'm not turning up.
Speaker B:I'm not just gonna.
Speaker A:No, ghosting is like, okay, you start to see someone and then you disappear.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:You don't like them anymore.
Speaker A:You're like, oh.
Speaker A:And then all the, you want to just avoid the drama.
Speaker A:I, I'm, I am a social coward.
Speaker A:Maybe I'm a little emotionally, like, I didn't, I've ghosted before.
Speaker A:Just like, oh, it's too much drama.
Speaker A:Oh, you know, like it's, you know, I, I like to peter it out.
Speaker A:Just.
Speaker B:I would let you know, I would just say, listen, I'm going through a lot.
Speaker B:I always blame myself for it.
Speaker B:So I'll say I'm going through a lot at the moment.
Speaker B:I have a lot of things to deal with work wise.
Speaker B:So I don't have time for this at the moment.
Speaker B:But let's, you know.
Speaker A:Okay, I'm gonna.
Speaker A:If we're being honest, I once there was a. I went on a date with.
Speaker A:He was this very handsome, very successful divorced hedge fund manager.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:Everyone wanted to go out with him.
Speaker A:And for whatever reason he decides he wants to go out with me.
Speaker A:We met at a barbecue, we met in person, we go on date or two and he, he starts to sort of do the love bombing thing, which is quite Flattering.
Speaker A:He got me a book of poems.
Speaker A:And this is book.
Speaker A:I said, oh, this is very nice.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:But then he would do also weird things.
Speaker A:So we would go in a restaurant and he'd always make sure we were off in this kind of weird.
Speaker A:Off to the side table and.
Speaker B:Which could be romantic.
Speaker A:Could be.
Speaker A:And something's telling me.
Speaker A:And then I think, so anyway, I was just.
Speaker A:I didn't feel a connection.
Speaker A:I felt something was a little odd.
Speaker A:So he.
Speaker A:He finally called me and he asked me for another date.
Speaker A:And I said, no, thank you.
Speaker A:And he was so flabbergasted.
Speaker A:He said, could you please, I'm asking you, could you be honest?
Speaker A:Why don't you want to see me again?
Speaker A:Like, like, like, like as if Brad Pitt had called me.
Speaker A:And I said, no, thank you.
Speaker A:And he was good looking, to be fair.
Speaker A:And he said, could you just tell me?
Speaker A:And I said, all right.
Speaker A:Honestly, I said, once you went downstairs in the middle of dinner and you came back with sort of a different personality.
Speaker A:I wasn't sure if you were doing drugs.
Speaker A:It was even a little more hyper.
Speaker A:But that wasn't.
Speaker A:I wasn't sure.
Speaker A:So that wasn't deal breaker.
Speaker A:And then another time I said, I just.
Speaker A:I said, you know, I can't read you.
Speaker A:I can read most people.
Speaker A:I can't feel you.
Speaker A:I feel like you're trying to tick a box and you want to seduce me to kind of like another.
Speaker A:Almost like it's like an accomplishment or that's what you're trying to do rather than feeling it.
Speaker A:Everything feels like you're going through emotion, you're checking a box as opposed to something that you want to do.
Speaker A:And then, okay, 10 years go by, whatever, never heard from her.
Speaker A:And then I was at a party and it happened to be.
Speaker A:I was with a friend and they brought me and it was his party.
Speaker A:Said, hello, Madeline Cohen.
Speaker A:I'm like, hello.
Speaker A:And so again, he wants to go out again.
Speaker A:And again it was.
Speaker A:Nothing really changed.
Speaker A:And he was quite frustrated because I just.
Speaker A:And I still didn't feel him.
Speaker A:To me, there was almost an undercurrent of misogyny.
Speaker A:And then he dated a friend of mine.
Speaker A:And I said, I don't know if I'd go there.
Speaker A:And she didn't listen.
Speaker A:And I heard indeed that it was a pretty toxic and messed up relationship.
Speaker B:Yeah, but maybe you just felt, you know, when you went out with him, maybe you just had this kind of feeling.
Speaker B:You had the feeling that, you know,.
Speaker A:I can do someone's kind.
Speaker A:I can tell when someone's decent.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:That's the thing.
Speaker B:You can usually.
Speaker B:I think one of the most important things when you're dating someone is.
Speaker B:I mean, for me, one of the most important things when I'm dating someone, apart from the obvious, is that they have empathy.
Speaker B:I need to go out with someone that has empathy.
Speaker B:Not only empathy for me, but for the world around them.
Speaker B:They have to be a very empathetic person, because I think with empathy, they can understand you better and they can give you the chance to understand them better, you know?
Speaker B:So it's a very important thing.
Speaker B:But that said, I'm going to quiz you on some terms.
Speaker A:Yes, please do, because I've got a.
Speaker B:Whole list of terms here.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker B:And let's see if Maddie knows what they are.
Speaker B:I'd prob.
Speaker A:We don't.
Speaker B: elds and key dating trends of: Speaker B:So I'm going to read a few of them and let's see if Maddie passes the test.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:So we all know what ghosting is, I suppose.
Speaker B:Love bombing.
Speaker B:We know.
Speaker A:Yeah, I. I haven't done the love bombing.
Speaker A:I've done the ghosting, but I've been love bombed.
Speaker B:So what about zombie?
Speaker A:Oh, that's.
Speaker A:That's when someone, like, ghosts you and then comes back, like, from the living dead.
Speaker A:Like, comes back to try and message you again.
Speaker B:So this is an unsettling pattern where they trigger a.
Speaker B:Don't let them come up confusion, you know?
Speaker A:My advice is people show you who they are, they're not gonna change.
Speaker A:Don't.
Speaker A:Like, don't.
Speaker A:Do you really need Act 2 or Act 3?
Speaker A:No, you don't.
Speaker B:Yeah, so we all know what gaslighting is.
Speaker B:So what about polterghosting?
Speaker A:Poltergeisting?
Speaker B:Polterghosting.
Speaker A:Oh, what's that?
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker B:It's setting up dates, then repeatedly canceling last minute, haunting your calendar without ever showing up.
Speaker A:For.
Speaker A:For me, I would let that happen once.
Speaker A:Once.
Speaker A:And then trying to, if it happened twice, out.
Speaker A:Forget it.
Speaker A:Erase them, delete, block, whatever.
Speaker A:They're just not your person.
Speaker B:So, situation shift.
Speaker B:Soft lunch.
Speaker A:Well, a situationship is where you're kind of seeing each other, maybe sleeping together, but you're not really.
Speaker B:Soft launch.
Speaker A:What's the soft lunch part of it?
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker B:It says publicly flirting with ambiguity by hinting you're involved without giving details or labels.
Speaker B:Instagram stories with two drinks, no tags.
Speaker A:I don't even know that.
Speaker B:So you're like, publicly flirting with ambiguity so you're trying to tell the public that you're involved, but you probably aren't.
Speaker B:Okay, so let's move on.
Speaker B:Guard railing.
Speaker A:Ooh, what's that?
Speaker A:That sounds good.
Speaker B:Crafting fierce boundaries to protect yourself from repeat disappointment.
Speaker B:No more texting after midnight.
Speaker B:No second chances for chronic cancellers.
Speaker A:That's what I just said.
Speaker A:But you know what?
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker B:Are you guard railing?
Speaker A:Not.
Speaker A:I don't think you're guardrailing.
Speaker A:I think you're just protecting your.
Speaker B:That's what the terms are.
Speaker A:Your life and your heart and your.
Speaker A:Your time is valuable.
Speaker B:Okay, what about nanoships?
Speaker A:What's that?
Speaker B:Micro flings that never move beyond a handful of witty texts offering a sugar high of connection with zero substance.
Speaker A:Okay, I'm gonna give you one.
Speaker A:Do you know what breadcrumbing is?
Speaker B:I know what breadcrumb is.
Speaker B:Everybody knows what breadcrumbs.
Speaker A:I thought it was.
Speaker B:They're giving you little bits, like a little message.
Speaker A:Little.
Speaker B:Little bits.
Speaker A:Little.
Speaker B:Who has time, you know, if you're breadcrumbing Me, honey.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:Kid.
Speaker A:Do you even reply?
Speaker A:I wouldn't even reply to that.
Speaker B:I don't have time for that last one.
Speaker B:Beige flags.
Speaker A:Well, not a red flag, obviously, and not.
Speaker A:Not a white flag, but a beige flag is just trying to walk the middle ground just so they can stay in the game.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Not quite a deal breaker.
Speaker B:Not quite a perk.
Speaker B:These traits define dating fatigue.
Speaker A:I have no time for meh.
Speaker B:I agree with you.
Speaker B:Nobody has time for meh.
Speaker B:So I think a lot of these behaviors today, people do them because they're dealing with emotional things themselves, and they found out that this is how they deal with it.
Speaker B:But the reason we mentioned this is it's good for you to kind of think about it if you do it to others.
Speaker B:Because if you.
Speaker B:If you're doing one of these things, like ghosting people or breadcrumbing them, you should actually.
Speaker B:I'm not going to say you should stop, but you should think, why am I doing this?
Speaker B:What am I trying to fulfill?
Speaker B:Because there's always an emotional need.
Speaker A:You're talking about sometimes.
Speaker A:Narcissists, they're not sitting there.
Speaker A:They're not looking deep inside.
Speaker A:They're looking to get that validation.
Speaker B:They're telling our audience to think about it.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Think about it.
Speaker A:But I would say more for people that are experiencing it, Protect yourself.
Speaker A:You know, I'd rather go see my girlfriend.
Speaker A:Rather go see a movie, go do that, than waste my time with someone who's got some completely different emotional gender.
Speaker A:That's going to damage me.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I think one of the main things I. I would tell anyone is, you know, you should set firm boundaries in dating.
Speaker B:Like we.
Speaker B:I mean, they don't.
Speaker B:You don't have to go on the date and say, I only do this, this, and this both.
Speaker B:Set boundaries for yourself and be authentic.
Speaker B:As long as you are authentic and you set boundaries and you just get rid of all the people that are bedcruming, ghosting and all those little things.
Speaker B:I think you're halfway there.
Speaker A:Do it early.
Speaker A:So I have a friend and they're married now, and the man was divorced.
Speaker A:He said, I don't want any more children.
Speaker A:I don't want to get married again.
Speaker A:And they go on their second date.
Speaker A:He sees her, he wants to go out with her.
Speaker A:And on the second date, she said, well, you know, I do want these things.
Speaker A:I want to get married, I want to have children.
Speaker A:So if you don't really want those things, then I don't see whether we should see each other again.
Speaker A:And lo and behold, they're married and she has the children.
Speaker A:So she set it out.
Speaker A:She set her intentions out.
Speaker A:Clearly.
Speaker A:I think that that was really good, actually.
Speaker A:And you know, she didn't.
Speaker A:She was in her early 40s at this time and didn't probably want to waste time.
Speaker A:And, you know, he came up, we showed up, he was there.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker A:So go ahead.
Speaker B:Another thing I was going to say was you have to embrace the micro gestures, but don't ignore the icky factor.
Speaker B:So if someone is showing you bits of affection, you can embrace it, but don't ignore the fact that it rel.
Speaker B:Relationship is much deeper than that.
Speaker B:So you know what I mean by that is sometimes you're in this relationship with someone and they're giving you micro gestures.
Speaker B:You know, like they might get you some flowers now, but then they do something else that's bad then.
Speaker B:And these are just little gestures, but they're not consistent.
Speaker B:So you have to.
Speaker B:You can embrace them.
Speaker B:But remember that a relationship is much deeper than that.
Speaker B:What I'm saying is you embrace the good, but don't fall for the bad.
Speaker B:And you have to come.
Speaker B:If you're being authentic, you'll talk to the person and you.
Speaker B:You have to go deeper than just them.
Speaker B:Because I've met a lot of people.
Speaker A:Trying to say is look at the big picture.
Speaker A:No, the whole picture.
Speaker B:No, what I mean is that sometimes people going to meet someone and those.
Speaker B:That person gives them little micro gestures like that, they're interested.
Speaker B:But you both now keep it surface, and you don't dig deeper.
Speaker B:And then eventually they break up and they say, yeah, but he always did this and he always did that.
Speaker B:And when I talk to them, I realize it's because even though he gave you those little gestures, you never sat down like your friend did, and said to the, you know, she could have just left it like that.
Speaker B:Like, oh, yeah, he said he doesn't want children, but I really want children, but he's so sweet, you know.
Speaker B:But she went deeper.
Speaker B:She went beneath and said, listen, I like you.
Speaker B:You don't want kids.
Speaker B:This is what I want.
Speaker B:And doing that made him think again and thought, I want to be with this woman.
Speaker B:And I ready, you know, to have kids with her.
Speaker B:But a lot of people are so scared of just opening themselves when they're in a relationship.
Speaker B:I've seen her happen many times, and I've seen.
Speaker B:I know someone, in fact, that she's dating someone.
Speaker B:He was very nice, did a lot of things with her for her, but they never went deeper.
Speaker B:But then he met someone else whilst they were dating, and she was totally.
Speaker B:She was more like, I remember when I'd speak to my friend, I'd say, over, why don't you go see him?
Speaker B:Why don't you cook for him?
Speaker B:And she'd be like, yeah, but I don't think he likes that.
Speaker B:And this other girl he met did exactly the opposite.
Speaker B:She delved deeper into him and he totally opened up.
Speaker B:And sometimes I think we don't go deep within our relationships enough because we don't want to be vulnerable.
Speaker B:And sometimes, if you want a relationship, vulnerability can really move it forward, even though you're scared, because if it's not the right person for you, they'll run.
Speaker B:But I'd rather they run away and be honest than have someone that's with me.
Speaker B:And I. I don't even.
Speaker B:They don't know who I am or I don't know who they are.
Speaker A:I don't.
Speaker A:I don't know about this whole kind of.
Speaker A:I. I think it's not so either this or that.
Speaker A:I. I would say that even.
Speaker A:I've had a couple relationships even currently, where we're really good friends now, like, we.
Speaker A:We.
Speaker A:So I think that's a success.
Speaker A:I think that's.
Speaker B:Yeah, but the friendship comes from you both knowing a lot more about each other.
Speaker B:He's seen you when you're angry and when you're, you know.
Speaker B:But people have relationships where they're never angry because they're both trying to avoid that.
Speaker B:And then it Breaks down.
Speaker B:That's what I mean, you know, so you.
Speaker B:He's seen parts of you that are real.
Speaker B:Basically.
Speaker A:I guess what I'm saying is that just to define a relationship as successful or not, it's not that you just break up and everyone never sees each other again.
Speaker A:But I think that I find a huge.
Speaker A:I feel like I was very successful in our friendship means that we like each other, we just like each other.
Speaker B:But I think the best relationships start from friendship, though.
Speaker B:I always think if you can be a friends with someone, that's why a lot of people to end up with people they went to school with or they went, you know, they knew since childhood.
Speaker B:Because if you can form a friendship first or you can become friends in a relationship, it trumps everything else.
Speaker A:You have to be friends.
Speaker B:That's the thing.
Speaker A:And to make a round circle what you're talking about and to bring back to what we're both talking about is if you're not showing your true self, like I want to, I want to read a book with you, or I want to whatever, watch a movie or cook with you or whatever you're saying, this is what I enjoy doing.
Speaker A:What do you enjoy doing?
Speaker A:And if we're not doing that together, we're not friends, okay?
Speaker A:We have to be friends above and beyond everything else.
Speaker A:And that means that someone should be your friend, friendly towards you, they should be kind to you, and you should be kind to them and enjoy doing things together.
Speaker A:I think that probably is a good place to start for a relationship.
Speaker A:Maybe the romantic part peters out, but then at least you'll have the friendship.
Speaker A:You'll have something you want.
Speaker A:And I find it a huge.
Speaker A:And even now I have an ex and, you know, happy to go out with he and his girlfriend.
Speaker A:And we're all friends, you know?
Speaker B:Yeah, I think so.
Speaker B:I, I hang out with some exes, some exes don't talk to me, but that's also fine.
Speaker A:I got that too.
Speaker A:Everybody has that.
Speaker B:And I.
Speaker B:One thing I want to say, even though we're not talking about this, men can be very vindictive when a relationship ends.
Speaker B:I say, I've seen that happen to so many women.
Speaker B:I don't think women are as bad, but I've seen men do the worst things.
Speaker B:I mean, women do it too, but women are more emotional.
Speaker B:So they're like, I just don't want to do it right now.
Speaker B:And I've seen men be very, very harsh sometimes when relationships end or their ex girlfriend just not talk to them.
Speaker A:Women have gone through.
Speaker A:I've, I've.
Speaker A:I've heard of and seen women cut up all their suits and.
Speaker A:I mean, people do crazy stuff to each other.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah, they do this crazy stuff.
Speaker B:They probably do deserve it.
Speaker B:They probably do deserve it.
Speaker B:I am.
Speaker B:I'm not saying that's what you should do to your boyfriend anyway.
Speaker B:I mean, if you're watching this on YouTube or something or you're listening, we'd love to hear from you and comment and subscribe and tell me if you've been gaslit before or love bombed everybody or Nana or what beige relationship.
Speaker B:Let me see some of those terms again.
Speaker B:Or if you've been nano or something.
Speaker A:I've been breadcrumbed and I don't think I. Breadcrumbs.
Speaker A:I don't have that much time.
Speaker A:I have.
Speaker A:I've been love bombed.
Speaker A:I've never loved bombed anybody, but I have.
Speaker A:I've been ghosted, I think.
Speaker A:And I've certainly ghosted because not, not out of anything because I just sometimes just shy away from the.
Speaker A:You know, but it's not being kind.
Speaker A:So all of those things, I would, I would.
Speaker A:Okay, so zombied.
Speaker A:I'd been zombied because someone come back from the living dead.
Speaker A:You're like, oh, no, not you again.
Speaker B:I guess I've.
Speaker B:I. I guess I, I guardrail too much.
Speaker B:So I'm busy guard railing.
Speaker B:So I don't have a chance to be zombied or love born.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Because I'm like, you gotta go.
Speaker A:You've been love bombed.
Speaker A:I remember we were at lunch once and a man was writing you.
Speaker A:He said, I was sending you a poem.
Speaker A:He wanted to write a poem about you.
Speaker A:He wanted.
Speaker A:And that was love bombing.
Speaker A:That's love bombing.
Speaker B:Yeah, but he was serious.
Speaker B:I just wasn't into it.
Speaker A:It's still love bombing.
Speaker B:Oh, it's still love bombing.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:That said, I think we've got to do a part two of this and.
Speaker A:Continue soon because we haven't even got who pays the bill.
Speaker A:How to handle that.
Speaker A:What?
Speaker A:You know.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:Because.
Speaker B:Yeah, we.
Speaker B:We can talk about it.
Speaker A:I mean, it's important.
Speaker A:It's not, it's not just like, you.
Speaker B:Know, who pays the bills in the dating when they go off.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And then.
Speaker A:And what it means and how to like, you know.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:I mean, who pays the bills the first date?
Speaker A:The man that's gonna be controversial.
Speaker A:He always has to pay the bills in my world.
Speaker B:Always.
Speaker B:The man pays the dinner bills.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:I'm not talking about the rent here, girls.
Speaker A:No, no.
Speaker A:Just as an Initial gesture, the man has to pay.
Speaker A:The first.
Speaker B:Yeah, I think for me, as the initial gesture.
Speaker B:But I think once the relationship transcends, it all depends on who is making the money.
Speaker B:And if I'm in a relationship with a guy and I'm.
Speaker B:And I have more money than he does, of course I could pay the rent.
Speaker B:I could pay.
Speaker A:No, no, no.
Speaker B:You know, if I'm.
Speaker B:If I'm way wealthier than he is, I would pay the rent because I'd be living in a mansion or in my big house.
Speaker B:And if he can't afford it and I decided to date him, I don't expect him to pay for that because, you know, if I'm way wealthier, why should I expect him to pay for things he can't afford?
Speaker A:We're still at the.
Speaker A:At the restaurant phase.
Speaker A:The first date, I mean.
Speaker B:Yeah, I said the first date.
Speaker B:I'm talking about if we are in a relationship here.
Speaker A:And I'll stick to this, and this is my advice to men.
Speaker A:She'd rather go to a pub and you pay than go to whatever Carbone.
Speaker A:And you're going to split the bill.
Speaker B:You know, the first date, the man always pays.
Speaker B:I agree.
Speaker B:It doesn't matter where we go.
Speaker B:The pub, that, this, that.
Speaker B:I mean, I think it's a responsibility.
Speaker B:It's just a nice thing to do.
Speaker B:Especially because it just shows his masculinity.
Speaker B:Anyway, on that note, I think we got a roundup.
Speaker A:Okay,.
Speaker B:Well, on that note, I think we're going to round up.
Speaker B:Let us know how your dating goes and who's love bombing you.
Speaker B:Breadcrumbing, Nano dating, beige, whatever.
Speaker A:Which apps you're using.
Speaker B:Oh, yes, I heard.
Speaker B:I'm not gonna tell you the apps.
Speaker B:Cause we're gonna do an episode about apps.
Speaker B:Cause I know some really good ones where you can find some really good guys.
Speaker A:Really?
Speaker A:Let's do an experiment.
Speaker A:I actually once for a guy friend, he was not getting that much luck.
Speaker A:And he was on Tinder.
Speaker A:And I said, let me rewrite your Tinder profile.
Speaker A:And he came back.
Speaker A:He was a kind of a technician.
Speaker A:He's like, I got 30% more.
Speaker B:She was good.
Speaker B:So until next time, it's Amanda.
Speaker A:Maddie, thank you for joining us.
Speaker B:Thank you.
