Episode 6
Navigating Adversity: Transforming Challenges into Growth
Adversity is an inevitable aspect of the human experience, yet it is our response to such challenges that ultimately defines our paths. In this discourse, we explore the paramount significance of cultivating a resilient mindset when confronted with setbacks. We emphasize the critical necessity of reframing our internal narratives, specifically urging listeners to eschew the detrimental cycle of self-deprecation that often accompanies failure. By adopting a perspective that prioritizes learning and growth, we assert that individuals can transcend their difficulties and emerge stronger. Through a series of personal anecdotes and practical strategies, we elucidate how one might navigate the tumultuous waters of adversity, fostering resilience and a renewed sense of agency in the process.
The conversation articulated in this episode presents a profound examination of adversity, a commonality shared by all individuals throughout their lives. The speakers delve into the essence of how one engages with adversity, positing that it is not the adversity itself that defines us, but rather the manner in which we respond to it. This pivotal distinction is explored through the lens of psychological resilience and the cultivation of a growth-oriented mindset. The speakers assert that overcoming adversity necessitates a conscious effort to learn from setbacks, thereby transforming potential failures into invaluable lessons that propel us forward. Central to their discourse is the theme of self-reflection and personal accountability. The speakers encourage listeners to introspectively assess their boundaries and self-respect, particularly in the context of interpersonal relationships. By challenging individuals to articulate what constitutes unacceptable behavior, the conversation seeks to empower listeners to reclaim their agency and foster healthier dynamics in their lives. The speakers also underscore the value of perspective, illustrating how a shift in our narrative can significantly alter our emotional responses to adversity. As the dialogue unfolds, it becomes evident that adversity, while often perceived as a stumbling block, can also serve as a catalyst for profound personal growth and transformation. The speakers remind us that each challenge we face carries with it the potential for insight and development, urging listeners to embrace the discomfort of adversity as a necessary aspect of the human experience. Through actionable strategies and a commitment to self-discovery, we can learn to navigate the complexities of life with resilience and grace.
Takeaways:
- Adversity is a universal experience, but it is our response to it that truly defines our character and future prospects.
- To overcome feelings of failure, one must actively engage in learning from past mistakes rather than dwelling on them indefinitely.
- The ability to shift one's mindset during challenging times is paramount for developing resilience and moving forward effectively.
- Proactive steps, such as seeking social support and practicing self-care, are essential in navigating through periods of adversity and discomfort.
Transcript
We all go through adversity, but that's not the important part.
Speaker A:You don't want the loop of, I'm a failure, I'm a failure.
Speaker A:I'm going to fail next time.
Speaker A:They got to immediately erase that data received moving forward.
Speaker A:I learned from this.
Speaker A:This is what I learned.
Speaker A:Now I'm going to move on.
Speaker A:That's overcoming adversity.
Speaker A:I've got the message.
Speaker A:I know what I could have done better, and now I'm going to learn from it.
Speaker A:You'll just repeat it again because you haven't taken the data.
Speaker A:You haven't taken the message received.
Speaker B:A very important thing is a lot of things we deal with in life are about mindset.
Speaker A:Universe did you a favor, and I hope you can see that.
Speaker A:Here's the thing.
Speaker A:Don't choose another man where your whole life is his life.
Speaker B:This is your current situation, Amanda.
Speaker B:Because I'm like, right, we've got to stop feeling sorry for yourself, get out of it.
Speaker A:Where does your threshold of self respect kick in?
Speaker A:What does he need to do for you to leave?
Speaker A:Because I want that to be really clear in your mind.
Speaker A:We're going to do some proactive steps to change, because just sitting here watching the train wreck happening is not going to help you.
Speaker B:First thing, calm down.
Speaker B:Change perspective.
Speaker B:In all those books you read about Cinderella and you're 20 years old, forget it.
Speaker B:Hi, everybody.
Speaker B:Welcome to off the Record.
Speaker B:My name is Amanda, and on the show with me today is Madeline.
Speaker B:We were thinking about some topics, some things to talk about, and as we have discussed shame recently, one of the things that came to mind was adversity.
Speaker B:Adversity touches every life.
Speaker B:Whether through loss, trauma, or prolonged stress.
Speaker B:We all face adversities at some point in our lives.
Speaker B:I always compare my life to a series of very high peaks and some not so low valleys at the moment because I've kind of learned to deal with adversity and deal with the setbacks I have in life.
Speaker B:So today we're gonna discuss those setbacks and talk about what you can do to help when you're going through adversity.
Speaker B:Maddie?
Speaker A:Well, as you said, we all go through adversity, but that's not the important part.
Speaker A:Adversity happens to everyone over your life.
Speaker A:It's how you deal with it that will set you apart, that will bring you the life that you want, right?
Speaker A:So it's overcoming adversity.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And I thought it was something very interesting.
Speaker A:I was watching, I think I was reading the article something maybe in the Sunday Times, and they were talking about when they.
Speaker A:What they found is that people who recover from adversity mode, there's methods to deal with it.
Speaker A:And Mossad agents, if they fail in a mission, what they don't want them to do is get this thing, I'm a failure, I'm a failure.
Speaker A:Or professional athletes, I'm a failure.
Speaker A:What you have to do, what they taught them to do, they literally taught them this method.
Speaker A:They say, data received or input received, meaning I'm going to learn from that mistake so I'm successful next time.
Speaker A:And when they take that internal message they're able to overcome instead of this, I'm.
Speaker A:This, you don't want the loop of, I'm a failure, I'm a failure, I'm going to fail next time, they got to immediately erase that data received moving forward.
Speaker A:And when they tell them that internal, that internal message, that's step one to overcoming it.
Speaker A:I learned from this.
Speaker A:This is what I learned.
Speaker A:Now I'm going to move on so I can go and move to the next stage of my life, or I'm going to overcome this.
Speaker A:They don't live with it that long.
Speaker A:So that's really step one to come at you.
Speaker A:I'm not saying it's easy, but what we view as failure, what do we learn from it?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I think one of the main things adversity does is it disturbs our sense of comfort and it enhances our resilience.
Speaker B:Because in that moment, you've got to challenge.
Speaker B:You've got to face the challenge.
Speaker B:You've got to.
Speaker A:You've got to face another challenge and another challenge and another.
Speaker A:That's got to live to fight another day.
Speaker A:They say if you think about people that we find really inspirational, continue to be inspirational.
Speaker A:Oprah Winfrey, if you read the story of her life and how.
Speaker A:And she just kept going, you know, and she had her message and she had her vision, and she went and achieved it.
Speaker A:And I find those sort of people really inspirational.
Speaker A:Yeah, but that's it.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:This happened.
Speaker A:Maybe I got fired from a job, and then you're gonna say, okay, what did I not do right?
Speaker A:What could I have done better to have made that career?
Speaker A:And what I'm gonna do better next time?
Speaker A:What when I, you know, at my next job.
Speaker A:So you, you know, that's, that's, that's overcoming adversity.
Speaker A:I've got the message.
Speaker A:I know what I could have done better, and now I'm gonna learn from it.
Speaker A:And that also saves you from, if you're in the loop Like I'm a loser or I'm.
Speaker A:This always happens to me.
Speaker A:I'm the victim.
Speaker A:Then you'll just repeat it again because you haven't taken the data.
Speaker A:You haven't taken the message received so that you can build upon it.
Speaker B:Yes, because adversity comes in all shapes or forms.
Speaker B:You know, it could be financial, economic, relationships.
Speaker B:It could be trauma.
Speaker B:Sometimes that you face a lot of trauma.
Speaker B:And sometimes it's like.
Speaker B:I compare it to being like an elastic band.
Speaker B:Sometimes you've really got to stretch to get over that hump, that adversity.
Speaker B:And occasionally it does change the way you think or the way you approach things.
Speaker A:Well, again, that's the data received.
Speaker B:I'm at friends, but it doesn't define you.
Speaker A:No, no.
Speaker A:I have a friend that.
Speaker A:She was married for a long time, and she was working and working and working, doing everything she could to make that marriage work.
Speaker A:She was.
Speaker A:And I think obviously he chose her because that was her personality.
Speaker A:That's what she was gonna do.
Speaker A:She was always nice, always doing everything, you know, and a very capable person, by the way, a very, very intelligent, capable woman.
Speaker A:And he left her.
Speaker A:He had an affair.
Speaker A:And he then came to her and said, I just need to know where this is gonna go.
Speaker A:And she was devastated.
Speaker A:Like a shell of a person, you know, really devastated because her whole life was built around him and raising the children and how painful.
Speaker A:And he can still feel the pain.
Speaker A:But when we speak.
Speaker A:And when she speaks about it, I said, yeah, but look at where you are now.
Speaker A:Like, look at how you're having this lovely holiday and you're visiting things and seeing things you wouldn't have.
Speaker A:I mean.
Speaker A:And I told her, I said, maybe the universe did you a favor, and I hope you can see that.
Speaker A:Here's the thing.
Speaker A:Don't choose another man where your whole life is his life.
Speaker A:You know, where's your life?
Speaker A:You're running around him.
Speaker A:Maybe he should have ran around you a little bit, and it was equal or at least some sort of that.
Speaker A:And then maybe you learned that you won't do that again, so the next time you'll be happier.
Speaker A:How can someone appreciate you if you let him use you as a doormat?
Speaker A:She's not going to appreciate you, you know, appreciate yourself.
Speaker A:Do things for yourself.
Speaker A:And she's, you know, kind of.
Speaker A:She's very, very painful, but she's.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker A:I see her moving on.
Speaker A:I see her doing her own thing.
Speaker A:I see her traveling a lot.
Speaker A:I see sort of getting involved, starting a career.
Speaker A:I can see it Now I can see that that light is happening.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I think a lot of people deal with adversity in different ways.
Speaker B:One of the most important things, I think is having a positive approach.
Speaker A:Well, positivity is everything.
Speaker B:Yeah, positivity is very important.
Speaker B:And also having adaptive skills.
Speaker B:So that flexibility, you've got to be flexible and it's not going to be comfortable.
Speaker A:Sometimes get outside your comfort zone.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:And a lot of it could sound easy, but in the moment where you're going through it, like Madeline just said, sometimes it doesn't seem like it's gonna end, but you fight through.
Speaker B:And you need tools to be able to do that.
Speaker B:So you've got to be able to have a good friend group around you.
Speaker A:Perhaps social support.
Speaker B:Social support.
Speaker B:Practice spirituality.
Speaker B:Maybe you meditate or something to take away the stress.
Speaker B:Or run, go to the gym, do a spin class, walk, something to get you your mind in tun.
Speaker A:I would definitely say that there are initial steps when you're dealing with adversity and you feel mired in it and you really feel like maybe I can't get out of bed, or I don't want to get out of bed, or I can't face the world.
Speaker A:I'm just overwhelmed.
Speaker A:And I promise you this, I promise you there are baby steps.
Speaker A:You're going to have to force yourself to do it.
Speaker A:You're going to force yourself to do it.
Speaker A:Get out and walk in the sunshine if you can.
Speaker A:That you won't want to.
Speaker A:We want to kind of sink into the mire of our misery because we're feeling it.
Speaker A:But to get rid of it, if you really, really want to get rid of it.
Speaker A:Step one, go for a walk in the sunshine.
Speaker A:Go exercise, take a spin class.
Speaker A:Do something that's good for your body.
Speaker A:You know that really.
Speaker A:And you know, watch a comedy, Put on something just your mind can't focus on being miserable and yet getting these data inputs at the same time.
Speaker A:So you're just shifting the focus of your mind.
Speaker A:This is why when the mind is a funny thing, if you're by yourself and all you can think about is how miserable you are and you're in the dark and you're shutting off all this kind of thing, you're just not gonna get there.
Speaker A:So you've got to change.
Speaker A:If you just do this, if you just go for a walk, if you say, okay, I'm gonna do this, I don't wanna do this, but I'm gonna do it, which means I'm gonna go for a walk, I feel this deep Tression.
Speaker A:If you go for a walk, go eat something delicious.
Speaker A:Go eat something delicious.
Speaker A:My grandmother used to say, no one ever killed themselves on a full stomach.
Speaker A:I don't know if that's true, but eat something delicious.
Speaker A:Just your mind kind of, you know, try and do something that makes you feel good.
Speaker A:Cause you're feeling so bad.
Speaker A:I think that you just have to break.
Speaker A:And then that means adversity often means breaking bad habits so this adverse situation doesn't come again.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:And what Maddie said there was really important because sometimes we break these bad habits so they don't happen again.
Speaker B:But as we know, we are human, we are flawed, and the world is full of surprises.
Speaker B:And adversity sometimes comes, as I said in health form, you might just get information that you're in bad health.
Speaker B:And it may be a challenge, both financially or maybe with your family.
Speaker B:But a very important thing is a lot of things we deal with in life are about mindset.
Speaker B:Don't allow your mind to sink into this kind of feeling sorry for your self state.
Speaker B:And you have to get out of it.
Speaker B:So if that walk in the sunshine or that meditation or just talking to people or reading a book gets you out of that mindset you're in, do it.
Speaker B:Because your first step is you need to get up and get out of that mindset.
Speaker B:And you have to be ready, as I said before, to be uncomfortable and also adapt to the change that's going to happen in your life.
Speaker B:One of the way I deal with adversity, which my friends always say to me, you are so good at this, is when anything goes wrong in my life.
Speaker B:Yeah, I feel sorry for myself just like everybody else for maybe like a day.
Speaker B:But then the next day I'm like.
Speaker B:Because I'm also a Buddhist and I practice Buddhism and I meditate.
Speaker B:And then I say to myself, okay, this is happening now.
Speaker B:This is your current situation, Amanda.
Speaker B:So now we're living in this situation, and how are we going to change it?
Speaker B:So I try.
Speaker B:Even though I know that stuff is happening, I put it aside.
Speaker B:And now I start to look into how I can change and move forward from this moment in this new circumstance.
Speaker B:I know the old circumstance has gone.
Speaker B:So obviously my world has shifted from where I thought it was comfortable to where now it's uncomfortable.
Speaker B:So I say, okay, I'm uncomfortable now.
Speaker B:What and what can you do to get out of this?
Speaker B:And I start like what Maddie said in the last episode.
Speaker B:I take a piece of paper or journal and I write all the baby steps and things I need to do.
Speaker B:I must say, adversity is also for me personally.
Speaker B:It propels my life forward because whenever I'm going through shit situations, I get up and I do all the things I probably wouldn't have done if I was being.
Speaker B:If I was a bit more comfortable and I'm a bit more productive and effective because I'm like, right, we've got to stop feeling sorry for yourself.
Speaker B:Get out of it.
Speaker B:And I know not everybody's like me, but I.
Speaker B:And I don't like feeling stressed or not being able to sleep well or those type of things.
Speaker B:So my thing is I get out of it by meditating and then taking action.
Speaker B:So I don't dwell in it.
Speaker B:I don't dwell in that adversity.
Speaker B:I take action towards.
Speaker B:And I don't want to simplify adversity because there's probably someone listening to this that's going through really challenging stuff, which could be a breakup, or maybe you are homeless at the moment and you don't have a place to live or your financial situation is so bad you're going to lose your home.
Speaker B:But one thing I also want to tell you is it'll be okay.
Speaker B:And it might sound simple, but for every situation I've had in my life where I thought it was the end, every time I look back and I.
Speaker B: I wasn't going to make it to: Speaker B:What.
Speaker B:And in that moment, I. I thought that was the end.
Speaker B:I was facing a war where I just thought, this is my life.
Speaker B:Nothing's happening, nothing will change.
Speaker B:But winter always turns into spring, so.
Speaker B:And it's a Buddhist quote that says winter always turns into spring.
Speaker A:It's a lovely quote.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And so you're only going through a winter of life and you will always get a spring.
Speaker B:That's life.
Speaker B:Everything changes.
Speaker B:And as long as you're taking action, your situation will never be the same.
Speaker B:So it's taking those baby steps.
Speaker A:I think it's very hard for people sometimes, many people, when they're in it, to be obviously positive.
Speaker A:And that's.
Speaker A:So it's kind of.
Speaker A:How do you get positive when you're feeling really, really negative?
Speaker A:You know, when you're feeling like I am, everything's dark and I'm a failure, or I'm whatever.
Speaker A:You gotta change your eternal script.
Speaker A:I think that one of the things they say to do, and this maybe sounds spiritual, but I think it really does work.
Speaker A:Okay, so this works.
Speaker A:This works.
Speaker A:When you wake up in the morning you cannot.
Speaker A:Or maybe right before you go to bed because you're just trying to set your mind before you for the rest of the night.
Speaker A:And you put one hand on your heart, and you put one on your tummy, and you listen.
Speaker A:It could be three things or five things you're grateful for, okay?
Speaker A:Just.
Speaker A:You're changing the way your mind thinks and you're listing gratitude.
Speaker A:It could be, I'm grateful that I.
Speaker A:It could be, I have my mother's love.
Speaker A:Or it could be, I'm grateful that, you know, I was able to go for a beautiful walk today, or I look forward to a cup of coffee tomorrow.
Speaker A:I have lovely coffee in my house.
Speaker A:And it could be very, very simple things.
Speaker A:You're saying what you're grateful for, okay?
Speaker A:Instead of going to bed with a script in your head, you know, just do that exercise, do it every night.
Speaker A:What are you grateful for?
Speaker A:And then you fall asleep on that.
Speaker A:And when you wake up, you do that.
Speaker A:What am I grateful for today?
Speaker A:Could be, it's sunny outside.
Speaker A:Oh, my bed's warm.
Speaker A:Or, you know, anything.
Speaker A:It could be almost anything.
Speaker A:Cause we actually.
Speaker A:Everyone has things to be grateful for.
Speaker A:You're alive.
Speaker A:I'm grateful.
Speaker A:I'm grateful.
Speaker A:It could be anything.
Speaker A:And if you start that, doing that, you really just start the mindset of gratitude.
Speaker A:Okay?
Speaker A:Then you start, sure, the negative thoughts, yes, the other things come back, but just change the script in your head.
Speaker A:That.
Speaker A:That one little step will change the script in your head.
Speaker A:And then baby steps, obviously, because that's not going to change it.
Speaker A:And then maybe you lost your job and you say, okay, I just, you know, what does that mean?
Speaker A:Or.
Speaker A:I have these financial problems.
Speaker A:I remember going through a really bad.
Speaker A:This is a real adversity, a bad breakup, financial problem, being a mess.
Speaker A:And a girlfriend came to stay with me, and she says, well, first of all, I'm here.
Speaker A:I love you.
Speaker A:And she's like, step one, get liquid.
Speaker A:And I was like, what?
Speaker A:She's like, you don't need that watch.
Speaker A:You don't need that car.
Speaker A:You know, all the things like, you know, just, we're going to list everything on a piece of paper that you're going to sell.
Speaker A:You're in a bad financial situation.
Speaker A:You sort it out.
Speaker A:And I was like, I don't want to sell my car.
Speaker A:But, you know, it happened.
Speaker A:We did, and we did it, and she did that.
Speaker A:And I am really grateful for what she did.
Speaker A:Instead of sitting here like, okay, we're going to.
Speaker A:I'll let you be miserable.
Speaker A:For a little bit.
Speaker A:But we're going to do some proactive steps to change, because just sitting here and watching, you know, the train wreck happening is not going to help you.
Speaker A:And I really think, like, super grateful for her.
Speaker A:Like, if I had to do my grateful thing, my gratitude thing, it could be.
Speaker A:I remember once thinking at first, when I first heard about, like, starting with gratitude, I was like, what do I have to be grateful for?
Speaker A:I can't think of anything.
Speaker A:And then you're walking down the street, and then the autumn leaves are falling.
Speaker A:They're quite beautiful.
Speaker A:And you say, I'm grateful that I'm passing that.
Speaker A:Or I'm.
Speaker A:I found that really helpful.
Speaker A:I'm grateful for some of my friends.
Speaker A:I'm grateful for whatever.
Speaker A:And by the way, it did change.
Speaker A:It didn't.
Speaker A:Not overnight, but I did come out of that situation.
Speaker A:I was okay.
Speaker A:More than okay.
Speaker A:But I took the hard decisions that she suggested and it happened.
Speaker A:It worked.
Speaker B:Yeah, Because a lot of it is also perspective.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:A lot of times when we go through adversity, it's the perspective and the storytelling, the stories we tell ourselves.
Speaker B:When you're going through adversity, it's a big change.
Speaker B:Something is changing in your life.
Speaker B:So automatically your mind starts telling you stories.
Speaker B:Oh, look at you.
Speaker B:You're gonna be homeless any minute now.
Speaker B:Oh, you know, you're gonna die.
Speaker B:You're sick, you're gonna die.
Speaker B:You know, we start telling ourselves these stories, and those stories a lot of times are not true, but it's where our mind takes us.
Speaker A:Well, okay, I would phrase it different.
Speaker A:I would say perspective is.
Speaker A:Your perspective is powerful.
Speaker A:Give you a very good example of this.
Speaker A:I have a friend, and she's a single mother, and the father of her son contributes, but not as much as she thinks he should contribute more.
Speaker A:And she was getting quite, like, upset about this.
Speaker A:And she spoke to someone who said, well, actually, you know what?
Speaker A:You're grateful that he's in your life.
Speaker A:You're grateful that you.
Speaker A:He allows you to.
Speaker A:He's such a good father to your child in the sense, not financially, but in many other ways.
Speaker A:You know, you're really lucky that you have him there.
Speaker A:And you like to, you know, that he's a parent that is with the child on weekends or every other weekend, and this.
Speaker A:And you need your time.
Speaker A:She said, yes, I need.
Speaker A:She said, well, change your perspective.
Speaker A:Change about what you're grateful that he does instead of.
Speaker A:Because you can't change him.
Speaker A:You can't change how much he's going to Financially participate, but you can change your perspective on what you're grateful for, what he does do, and what he does, he is doing.
Speaker B:Yeah, but that's in a situation where.
Speaker A:She changed her perspective.
Speaker B:Yeah, but your perspectives comes from the stories you tell yourself.
Speaker B:When you're going through adversity, the reason people when you're going.
Speaker B:The first thing that happens when we're going through any challenge is there's a story in our head straight away of what's gonna happen if things go wrong.
Speaker B:For example, if you can't pay your rent, you're already thinking you're gonna get evicted.
Speaker B:That's the first thing that comes to mind.
Speaker B:Like, shit, I'm gonna get evicted.
Speaker B:I'm not gonna have a home to stay.
Speaker B:And it's not necessarily true.
Speaker B:It's just that that's the, you know, our brain things of the.
Speaker B:The worst case scenario.
Speaker B:And so I think when we start to change the narrative, the perspective, the narrative, the story, it gives you this first step in a situation when you're going through adversity to see the light.
Speaker A:Well, yes, so that my story was she changed her perspective on it and now they have a very good relationship.
Speaker A:What has changed in him?
Speaker A:Adding more financial.
Speaker A:None.
Speaker A:What has changed in terms of.
Speaker A:She changed her perspective.
Speaker A:She has a much better relationship.
Speaker A:The child is much happier.
Speaker A:That's the best that she could hope for.
Speaker A:And she's no longer bitter and angry about it because it was affecting other parts of her life.
Speaker A:So I think your perspective is a powerful, powerful tool if you're able to change it.
Speaker A:What you do, what you describe, for example, when you, you're feeling badly, okay, I'm gonna feel sorry for myself.
Speaker A:I do this too.
Speaker A:I'm gonna give myself this day to feel sorry for myself.
Speaker A:I have every right to sit there and feel sorry.
Speaker A:But tomorrow I don't have the luxury of sitting every day and doing, feeling sorry for myself.
Speaker A:I give myself one day I have to feel things.
Speaker A:I'm human, I'm gonna feel things.
Speaker A:But tomorrow I'm not gonna sit around and feel sorry for myself.
Speaker A:I've gotta take some proactive actions, whatever those might be.
Speaker A:You get out your little notebook and you write them down and you're gonna.
Speaker A:What you're going to do.
Speaker B:And also, you know, think of one action that could offer a sense of agency or control.
Speaker B:Because sometimes the situation seems out of control.
Speaker B:But there's one thing you can control in that situation.
Speaker B:So in your situation, you had this financial thing, you had an ex boyfriend split up, but there Was a situ you could control.
Speaker B:Your friend came and said, well, list your property, let's sell this.
Speaker B:So there was still some things you could control right there.
Speaker B:You took a little bit of control of your financial situation because you raised the money.
Speaker A:Yeah, got liquid, as she said.
Speaker A:We're gonna get liquid quick.
Speaker B:Yeah, you got liquid, you know, and you managed to raise some funds and you did what you had to do.
Speaker B:So I think rather than feel everything's out of your control, think about what you can control and what you can't.
Speaker B:Because sometimes I think when things happen, we're just so caught in the emotion that we let everything go.
Speaker B:And then when we look back, we think, I could have done this, I could have done this.
Speaker B:Why did I.
Speaker B:Why did I do this?
Speaker B:It's happened to me, even with general things where I think, oh, I should have thought of that earlier.
Speaker B:But in the moment I was just like.
Speaker B:And that's why it's always good to calm yourself down.
Speaker B:That's what I do.
Speaker B:I calm myself down.
Speaker A:That's good.
Speaker B:And then I look at what's going on and I think, okay, where are we going to start now?
Speaker B:There's.
Speaker B:And I go, you know?
Speaker B:You know what I mean?
Speaker B:Because otherwise I'm like all over the place.
Speaker B:I don't know where to start.
Speaker B:And adversity makes our heart race because as we said, your perspective just gets screwed in the moment when you go through an adverse thing.
Speaker B:And I know adversity could also be very, very traumatic, you know, like people that lose children or parents or family, you know.
Speaker B:And I'm not here to say it's that easy because when it comes to relationships, it can be very, very challenging to get over.
Speaker A:I am.
Speaker A:I was on holiday with my son, who was young, and my father, who never cries, called me and told me my brother had died suddenly.
Speaker A:And there was the shock, there was this.
Speaker A:And then my mother's calling me, crying.
Speaker A:And I didn't want my son to know.
Speaker A:I didn't want to ruin his holiday.
Speaker A:He didn't spend much time with my brother.
Speaker A:And I would say to myself, okay, I'm gonna go down, have lunch, I'm not gonna discuss it.
Speaker A:And remember, I'm on holiday, so I'm not around people that I can discuss it with.
Speaker A:I did call very close friends and talk about it, but I said, I wanna cry.
Speaker A:And I'm go back to my room and from three to five o'clock I'll cry.
Speaker A:I'll just sit there and cry.
Speaker A:And I did this for a couple I just don't want my son.
Speaker A:I don't want to ruin his holiday.
Speaker A:I was trying my best.
Speaker A:I cried and I cried, but when he wasn't around, and I'm sure he knew, and then finally I had to tell him.
Speaker A:I was trying to control it, and I wasn't.
Speaker A:Then I had to stop speaking to my mother for a while because I couldn't help her heal.
Speaker A:We couldn't cry together.
Speaker A:I felt some.
Speaker A:I don't know correctly or incorrectly.
Speaker A:I just felt like I needed.
Speaker A:Like I said, you know, I need my time to mourn, too, and I can't mourn with you.
Speaker A:I need to mourn.
Speaker A:And my father, who I wasn't used to crying.
Speaker A:So, yeah, it took a long.
Speaker A:Took a long time.
Speaker A:But I remember trying to manage it, saying, okay, I'm going to give myself two hours, and then I'm going to give myself three hours.
Speaker A:And that doesn't work because, you know, what happens is, you know, you'd be in a meeting and someone would mention their brother, and I just remember just crying, crying in the meeting.
Speaker A:And they were really shocked.
Speaker A:And I said, I'm really sorry my brother passed away.
Speaker A:And then they were like, no, no, no.
Speaker A:And then they would I walk you out the door.
Speaker A:Can I?
Speaker A:You know, so.
Speaker A:So I wouldn't recommend my strategy, your.
Speaker B:Strategy, but that was the strategy at the time you used, because you were with your son and you had to deal with it.
Speaker B:And I think everybody finds their way.
Speaker B:But in a way, what you did there was you created a safe space for your crying and then a safe space for your son.
Speaker B:So you manage the situations thinking, I'm feeling like this.
Speaker B:I don't want to cry all the time.
Speaker B:And even though it's hard, at the same time, I don't want my son to get affected.
Speaker B:So you decided what was best for that situation.
Speaker A:I mean, people were calling me to obviously offer their condolences.
Speaker A:I didn't even pick up the phone.
Speaker A:I said, I'm not gonna do this.
Speaker A:I'm not gonna sit there and cry with everyone and tell my story.
Speaker A:And then people would say, look how cold she is.
Speaker A:She didn't even, you know, discuss it.
Speaker A:She didn't want.
Speaker A:I said, how in the world would you know what is happening inside me?
Speaker A:You're sitting there sitting in judgment of me and my grief and my mourning.
Speaker A:Okay?
Speaker A:If you've watched our other podcasts, you know what I'm gonna say.
Speaker A:Cut those people out of your life.
Speaker A:Okay?
Speaker A:Cut them out.
Speaker A:That should have been like, sign you know, I should have said, okay, when you get over the morning, check, check out, you know, put that in your notebook.
Speaker A:You know, you're sitting in judgment.
Speaker A:You don't have any empathy.
Speaker A:My brother died and you're sitting there saying, oh, you're not approving of how I'm mourning.
Speaker A:I should have known immediately.
Speaker A:I learned later much the harder way, because I didn't do that.
Speaker A:I should have said, this person doesn't have empathy.
Speaker A:Someone who doesn't have empathy is not going to be a good part of your life.
Speaker A:They are not going to add to your life.
Speaker A:They can't, yes, they will take away.
Speaker A:So I didn't do that.
Speaker A:But that really did happen.
Speaker A:They sat around, they said, you know, look how cold she is.
Speaker A:Look how.
Speaker B:But you know, adversity also has good parts.
Speaker B:It makes you resilient.
Speaker B:It makes you resilient.
Speaker A:Do you think?
Speaker A:And I was going to, I want to.
Speaker A:Do you learn resilience or do I wonder if it's even genetic?
Speaker A:Part of us, you know, some of.
Speaker B:Us are partly, I'd say it's partly genetic, but a lot of it, if you look at a lot of very successful people, when you read their life stories, they had a lot of adversity and they faced it head on.
Speaker B:And you become more resilient because if something has happened to you once, it's easier to deal with the second time.
Speaker A:I don't know how we define successful person first, but I was thinking, if you think of Steve Jobs, he was adopted, wasn't close.
Speaker A:Now by all accounts, he wasn't a nice guy.
Speaker A:Nice to work for a night like this, but you ended up being successful.
Speaker B:Yeah, it doesn't mean they're going to be nice, but.
Speaker B:And some people turn out like that because they're just more resilient adversity.
Speaker B:A good example I would give to you about adversity and resilience is immigrants that move to other countries, they tend to be very successful.
Speaker B:Some of them, you know, become doctors, lawyers.
Speaker B:And some of them, when you hear of their, when you hear their stories, their parents came as you know, and they ran a little shop and they saved up for their kid to go to school.
Speaker B:And this kid went to school and he had to come home and work in the shop and he worked for years in the store, in his parents store.
Speaker B:And he became a doctor in this success.
Speaker B:And there's so many stories of immigrants that have built lives that are unfathomable.
Speaker A:For themselves, you know, so we're gonna go back to perspective and I'll tell a story.
Speaker A:And very famous, very famous number one bestseller author Ron Chernow wrote Hamilton the Musical.
Speaker A:He's a personal friend.
Speaker A:Not that I'm gonna name drop.
Speaker A:I'm not really big into name drop.
Speaker A:I'm gonna do this, for example.
Speaker A:And he would talk about that how his father.
Speaker A:So his father, grandfather ran a little corner grocery store like near Chinatown.
Speaker A:He ends up going to Yale and he went to state school.
Speaker A:And he talks about it.
Speaker A:He's like that time and he talks about his perspective.
Speaker A:He's like, all the best teachers were women teachers.
Speaker A:Cause they didn't have any other careers.
Speaker A:So all these really intell and educated women were teachers.
Speaker A:So he got this amazing education.
Speaker A:It's like it goes on to Yale.
Speaker A:It's his perspective, the way he put this charm.
Speaker A:I said to him, you always should write a memoir.
Speaker A:The things that you say and tell me about.
Speaker A:I mean, just really the perspective was what some people could look at as maybe a toplight.
Speaker A:He just thought and he told me this funny the way he put this twist.
Speaker A:Again, that's why he's a great writer.
Speaker A:A funny twist on it.
Speaker A:His perspective wasn't.
Speaker A:It's just the perspective and the way we can see things and how everyone can see the same thing, but just in a different way.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because also when you think about that when he was growing up, even though you could talk about.
Speaker B:One could talk about the Cornish off and something, he didn't look at that as lack because his parents gave him the love he needed, probably.
Speaker B:And he just looked at that as this is my life and I'm just gonna learn and do the things I want to do.
Speaker B:So his perspective was never warped.
Speaker A:He went to Yale and I think at the time Yale had a quota of only how many Jewish students they would take.
Speaker A:You know, I mean, can you imagine?
Speaker A:And then I think he was.
Speaker A:He either went to Oxford or Cambridge, I think he told me.
Speaker A:And just the funniest experience.
Speaker A:And then how his parents came to visit him and just how they were sort of in awe of the whole thing.
Speaker A:And I just remember that, you know, what a.
Speaker A:But the charm of it, seeing the charm of it.
Speaker A:Not anything but that.
Speaker A:And then sometimes you talk to people and they're just bitter.
Speaker A:And I guess what we're trying to say is how do you get rid of that bitterness?
Speaker A:I mean, we all.
Speaker A:We were talking earlier about, you know, overcoming adversity in our own childhoods and the issues that we dealt with.
Speaker B:I always think, you see, when you go through adversity in childhood especially, you have one or two ways.
Speaker B:You either become the savior or the abuser.
Speaker A:Think it's just either or, you know, there's no other.
Speaker B:Sometimes there's a middle ground.
Speaker B:But I think, you know, when people, especially when people that go to that have been abused as children, a lot of people, because of that, have empathy, and we go on to change their lives and become amazing people.
Speaker B:But some people, because the shame has become so deep and they've never let it go, they end up becoming, not on purpose, the very thing they were running away from because it's so ingrained, it's like a wall that's pushing you down.
Speaker B:You keep on trying to get over it, and every time you try to get over it, it's like this.
Speaker B:So if you don't seek help or you don't.
Speaker B:It's almost like a shadow.
Speaker B:Childhood trauma in particular can be very.
Speaker B:Because those are your formative years before you even knew what life was.
Speaker B:It can be very, very challenging to get to overcome.
Speaker B:And that's why you find with a lot of murderers and these people, a lot of them had really bad childhoods, like awful childhoods or they were molested or something.
Speaker B:Because it's your formative years, you know, you're like growing up, you haven't experienced the world yet.
Speaker B:If adversity later on in life can also be challenging, especially if you've had a very comfortable life and you've come across adversity, and some people go into drugs and alcohol and that.
Speaker A:You know, it's funny that you mentioned that, because what we read about the Wall street crashes, you know, whatever in the 20s or they're calling, people jump out of the building, they kill themselves.
Speaker A:They don't have any money.
Speaker A:I think that's mostly men.
Speaker A:They can't see past the life.
Speaker B:That's the thing.
Speaker A:I was thinking about the meaning of life, and I read this Viktor Frankl book, and he was a Holocaust survivor.
Speaker A:I said, well, if anyone knows how to overcome adversity, it's probably this man.
Speaker A:And the only thing that he said that I thought I took away, I should have taken away probably a lot more from this book was that when you repeat in your head, I could have.
Speaker A:I should have.
Speaker A:You know, I would have.
Speaker A:You didn't.
Speaker A:If you keep looking backwards.
Speaker A:I used to be, you know, we could all look back when we were 21.
Speaker A:I used to be looked like this, or.
Speaker A:Or I used to be this rich before.
Speaker A:Or I had this.
Speaker A:Or this person used to love me.
Speaker A:They no longer Love me.
Speaker A:If you're looking backwards, you are not going to be happy.
Speaker A:You are not going to overcome adversity, because you can't drive forward when you're looking backwards.
Speaker A:So he said, basically, that's the message I took.
Speaker A:Looking backwards brings you nothing.
Speaker A:Okay?
Speaker A:That brings you nothing except for what you learned from it.
Speaker A:But there's nothing.
Speaker B:I agree.
Speaker A:Hope and looking forward, like, this is what I want to achieve.
Speaker A:This is where I want to go.
Speaker A:Remember, he's a Holocaust survivor.
Speaker A:You go.
Speaker A:And he said that the people who lived in the camps were the ones who had hope and they were looking forward and said, okay, when I get out of here, I'm going to climb that mountain, or I'm going to go walk down and do so that if you're sitting there and I had a girlfriend and maybe you're going to say, you can see, I was way too harsh on her.
Speaker A:We were driving past a hotel, and she said to me, oh, that's where my ex boyfriend and I used to stay.
Speaker A:And we had such a lovely time.
Speaker A:And she was kind of sniffling a little bit, and I was like, how long has it been since you were with him?
Speaker A:She Sundays, it's been three years.
Speaker A:She's very sad.
Speaker A:And I said, do you think when he drives past the hotel, he's talking to his partner about you?
Speaker A:Is he thinking that or has he moved forward?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So you're gonna say I was really harsh.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:You're gonna say.
Speaker A:And she looked.
Speaker A:And I said, you need to look forward.
Speaker A:Stop looking in the past.
Speaker A:You had a lovely time.
Speaker A:That's great.
Speaker A:But why are you still crying over him?
Speaker A:It's three years now.
Speaker A:Please look forward.
Speaker A:Please go on a dating app.
Speaker A:Go meet someone.
Speaker A:Go do something so you can write a new story.
Speaker B:A new story?
Speaker A:A new chapter.
Speaker A:Yeah, like, you know, instead of thinking about him.
Speaker A:That was three years ago.
Speaker A:Okay, Maybe it wasn't that great after all.
Speaker A:You know, Move forward.
Speaker A:Whatever.
Speaker A:Habit.
Speaker A:Doesn't matter.
Speaker A:You learn from it.
Speaker A:You go on an app.
Speaker A:Let's see.
Speaker A:Let's do.
Speaker A:If you want me to create a profile for you, I'll write it.
Speaker A:I'll do it.
Speaker A:I'm not above that.
Speaker A:I'll write that, you know, which you would do, too, for someone.
Speaker A:And I just.
Speaker A:It broke my heart.
Speaker A:I was almost angry at her, but angry for her.
Speaker A:Like, why are you doing this to yourself?
Speaker A:You're hurting someone I love, okay?
Speaker A:And I did it with kindness.
Speaker A:And, you know, I sort of beat myself up because maybe I was a little tough.
Speaker A:I Didn't want to make her cry, but I just made.
Speaker A:Want to stop guilt.
Speaker A:I said, we're on our way.
Speaker A:We were going on our way to see, I don't know, the Sex and the City movie or something like that.
Speaker A:We're going to Notting Hill.
Speaker A:We're going to the Electric.
Speaker A:We got the big seats.
Speaker A:We're going to have a little glass of wine.
Speaker A:And you're sitting here crying over.
Speaker A:Just because we drove past this, like.
Speaker A:And I just.
Speaker A:Please, like, be kind to yourself.
Speaker A:Do something.
Speaker A:Let's get on dating.
Speaker A:Let's do something that you're not thinking in the past.
Speaker A:You're not looking.
Speaker A:Don't look backwards.
Speaker A:Don't look backwards and think.
Speaker A:My life was so much better that if you're thinking that, you will not move forward.
Speaker A:Absolutely not.
Speaker A:That is one deep truth.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because the skills, the insights and the compassion that sometimes come from adversity are life changing.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:And so what you're trying to do is actually develop that skill set to deal with adversity so the same adversity doesn't happen over and over again.
Speaker A:Maybe giving too many examples, but I had a friend and she had a boyfriend that was borderline abusive.
Speaker A:I mean, he would borrow money, he wouldn't pay it back.
Speaker A:He was aggressive with her.
Speaker A:She didn't tell me everything.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And I sat with her and I said to her, I said, okay, I just want to understand something.
Speaker A:So he pushed you, he's borrowed money from you, you suspect he's cheating on you and you haven't left.
Speaker A:I said, I want to.
Speaker A:No, I'm not laughing at someone because, you know, people are in this way.
Speaker B:You said it.
Speaker A:I said so.
Speaker A:I said, okay, so let's be clear for us.
Speaker A:Where does your threshold of self respect kick in?
Speaker A:What does he need to do for you to leave?
Speaker A:Because I want that to be really in your mind.
Speaker A:So when it happens, you leave.
Speaker A:Because I keep seeing you lowering and lowering and lowering your standards and accepting and accepting what I don't think you should accept.
Speaker A:And I said, so in my mind, you tell me now, what does he need to do?
Speaker A:Does he need to hit you?
Speaker A:Does he need to what?
Speaker A:And I said, because what's happening here is he keeps pushing the boundaries, behaving worse and worse and worse, and you keep taking it and resenting him for it.
Speaker A:So you're getting unhappier.
Speaker A:So eventually, what?
Speaker A:Until he leaves you and you leave you a shell and said, I don't want to see that happen.
Speaker A:And that was a hard conversation.
Speaker A:To have.
Speaker A:I don't.
Speaker A:And I felt terrible saying those things.
Speaker A:I felt terrible.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:But I was trying to help her go forward, to overcome these adverse things with this person.
Speaker A:And I don't know whether it was the right thing or not.
Speaker A:You tell me.
Speaker B:Yeah, I think you were trying to let her see perspective.
Speaker B:What you were doing by that is.
Speaker B:Look, you were just trying to switch the perspective, like, look at it from another way.
Speaker B:But the way you just said it was different.
Speaker B:But when people are going through adversity, it's like everything we go through as humans in life, we are not thinking straight because I think our hormones kick in, the fight or flight response kicks in.
Speaker B:You don't know what to do.
Speaker B:And it can just be overwhelming.
Speaker B:And first thing, calm down.
Speaker B:Second thing, change perspective and find the one thing in that whole problem you can change.
Speaker B:Because no matter how crazy something is, there's one thing you are in control of.
Speaker B:You're not totally.
Speaker B:You've not totally lost control.
Speaker B:It might seem like that, but there's always one thing you can control.
Speaker B:And it could be just your mindset, or it could be, as Maddie said earlier, going to pawn a few things to pay that bill.
Speaker A:This is gonna stick with me forever.
Speaker A:This is gonna stick with me forever.
Speaker A:I lived it.
Speaker A:I'll put my hand up.
Speaker A:I lived it.
Speaker A:I did it.
Speaker A:So when everyone thinks that, you know,.
Speaker B:No, I've done that before.
Speaker B:I've gone to sell things.
Speaker B:I mean, just because I had to move the money elsewhere or pay something.
Speaker B:Listen, it is what it is.
Speaker B:It's life.
Speaker B:It's tough.
Speaker B:It's crazy out there.
Speaker B:And that's part of also overcoming adversity, accepting that life is messy.
Speaker A:Everyone's been heartbroken.
Speaker A:I mean, that might be our next podcast, so we wouldn't deal with that.
Speaker A:But everyone's had their heart broken.
Speaker A:Everyone's had financial ups and downs.
Speaker A:Almost everyone.
Speaker A:Everyone's had to deal with family issues, grief, trauma.
Speaker A:It's just how you get over it.
Speaker B:Part of life.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's how you get over it.
Speaker B:And you know, life is messy.
Speaker B:And it's how you take that messy soup and throw some pepper in it, tomato sauce, and whip it all together and create something unique for you.
Speaker B:You.
Speaker B:Your own soup of life.
Speaker B:You know, it's not.
Speaker B:Life is not always smooth sailing.
Speaker A:I would do something.
Speaker A:I mean, that's what we say.
Speaker A:I'd take the.
Speaker A:The bad parts and kick it out the door and learn from it and then move forward.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:So that's what you're gonna do, take a ladle, put it in your soup, take out the pepper, throw it aside, put in some spinach and go keep it cooking, you know?
Speaker B:Cause this is life.
Speaker B:This is life.
Speaker B:And nobody ever said it was easy.
Speaker B:It was never gonna be a fairy tale.
Speaker B:And all those books you read about Cinderella and you're 20 years old, forget it.
Speaker B:There is no Cinderella story.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:Thank you for joining us.
Speaker A:I think we're out of time, but thank you for joining us.
Speaker A:And then please join in for the next podcast with Amanda and Madeline to talk about life.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Thank you for joining us.
Speaker B:And don't forget, if you are going through an adverse situation, you just have.
Speaker A:To talk to someone.
Speaker B:Talk to someone.
Speaker A:Take a moment.
Speaker B:There's always light at the end of the tunnel.
Speaker B:Thank you.
